RICHARD KING, HOST: Good morning, Prime Minister.
ANTHONY ALBANESE, PRIME MINISTER: Good morning, Richard.
KING: It's a terrible tragedy that happened up at Wieambilla in in Queensland yesterday afternoon.
PRIME MINISTER: This is a terrible tragedy and all Australians this morning will be mourning with the family of the police officers who've lost their lives in the line of duty and others who've had been injured. But all police officers will be feeling it today and their families. Police put their lives on the line for their fellow Australians each and every day, and this tragic news will be heartfelt around the country.
KING: Yes, indeed. All right now, power to the people, that's a very hot topic. You're bringing Federal Parliament back on Thursday in order to pass your plan to lower rising energy costs for households and small businesses. You're confident that the energy plan will pass, but certainly a lot of comments suggesting that it might be with a bit of difficulty. I spoke to Ted O'Brien yesterday, he's the Shadow Climate Change and Energy Minister. He thinks the plan won't work. Why do you think this plan will work? And firstly, if you wouldn't mind just outlining exactly what you will be attempting to do on Thursday, Prime Minister?
PRIME MINISTER: Well, it's a four point plan. The first is to put a cap on gas prices for 12 months, a temporary cap of $12 per gigajoule that is aimed particularly at our manufacturers and making sure that the price rises in global energy costs, as a result of Russia's invasion of Ukraine, don't flow through to Australian domestic users. And so the Federal Government will put a price cap on gas. In New South Wales and Queensland - through both regulation in Queensland's case and through legislation in New South Wales - will put a cap on coal of $125 per tonne for electricity generation. And then, in addition to that, a household support package of one and a half billion dollars matched by the levels of government, so a $3 billion package to provide energy price relief for pensioners and all recipients of Commonwealth payments. And fourthly, in the medium-term, a plan to secure our energy future by having increased supply through the capacity investment scheme that was agreed by all state and territory ministers along with our Energy Minister Chris Bowen last Thursday. So we're looking at, in the medium-term, how we increase supply. We saw, under the former government, four gigawatts lead system and only one gigawatt enter. So we've had less supply because they didn't have that investment certainty under the former government. But we're also dealing with the short-term pressures which are there by introducing this short-term price cap. It will allow, of course, for profits to continue to be made. It is a reasonable measure and it's a responsible measure. But we can't just sit back as Ted O'Brien would wish and see these high prices, not just for exports, that will of course continue, but for these extraordinary profits to be made whilst Australian manufacturers aren't able to continue to operate.
KING: Ted O'Brien says it will kill off gas, that nobody's going to invest. He's of the opinion we need gas at the moment, but this putting a price cap on gas is going to kill off gas in Australia.
PRIME MINISTER: Well that's nonsense, of course. And this bloke was part of a government that has been in government for just about the last decade, that hasn't seen supply come on during that period. And he says that after six months, why haven't the current government been able to magically increase supply? Well, it takes time. And what we had from the former government was a decrease in supply. His recipe is to sit back and do nothing. I make no apologies for standing up for Australian businesses and Australian manufacturers, as well as providing support for Australian households. We have seen this global price spike that's occurred right around the world, leading into inflation as a result of the Russian invasion of Ukraine. You would think that the Opposition is unaware that there has been a war in Europe and that it's having that global price spike as a result. But there's no reason why you should not give consideration to the fact that there hasn't been an increase in the extraction costs for Australian producers. What there has been is that massive increase that they've benefited from due to the global cost increases. But we need to make sure that Australian businesses can continue to operate, which is why we have flagged this measure for some period of time. There's been extensive consultation. And it is disappointing, frankly, that the Opposition appear to be prepared to say, 'Yes, we're not prepared to do anything. We support higher price prices for energy for both households and manufacturers.'
KING: You've said that your government's proposal will lead to families seeing their power bills drop by up to $230. How did you arrive at that figure?
PRIME MINISTER: Well that's a Treasury figure. And what Treasury have seen is that the cap on prices will put that downward pressure, which will result in prices being $230 less than they would be otherwise. And in addition to that, we are providing specific household support for Commonwealth recipients of payments.
KING: Right. And how much will that be? Has that been worked out? And how will that be delivered? As I understand it, you've said that will be in the form of lower bills rather than a handout, which everybody accepts will only add to inflation?
PRIME MINISTER: That's right. We've worked this through and calibrated it very carefully to put downward pressure on inflation. So we'll work through states and territories for the relief to result in lower power bills because a cash payment would increase inflation.
KING: But if it's going to result in lower bills, how are you going to work that out with energy providers? You're going to give them the money?
PRIME MINISTER: No, it would be done through state governments. They will do that. The state governments, in some cases, own the energy companies. In others they regulate them. And that's why it will be done through the states and territories to make sure that it is delivered to households, particularly for those who most need it. So your listeners who are pensioners, or who are recipients of Family Tax Benefits or JobSeeker payments will all receive that relief.
KING: But I'm still not quite sure what state governments are going to tell these energy providers: 'You've got to charge them less', is it?
PRIME MINISTER: It will be off the bill that energy providers provide to households.
KING: Right.
PRIME MINISTER: But there's a range of schemes happening right now, Richard, where state governments are providing some relief to households. And this will be done through a similar scheme to those which operate right around the country at various times and which are operating right now in various states.
KING: Right. And there's been the suggestion that the compensation may be paid to coal and gas companies and that's certainly something that Adam Bandt and the Greens have objected to wholeheartedly. Is there any suggestion that you're going to be paying compensation to coal and gas companies?
PRIME MINISTER: Well, what we'll make sure is for coal producers taking their resource to the electricity companies for production, that if the costs of production is more than the $125, that there will be support provided for them. We want to make sure that businesses can continue to receive support.
KING: Right, and I do apologise we had a bit of music popped in there. I don't know where that came from.
PRIME MINISTER: A bit of Randy Newman.
KING: Yeah it is a bit of 'Short People'. Look, Ted O'Brien also established a website, 'Let's Talk About Nuclear'. And he's not suggesting that's the way we should go, but we should have a conversation. But certainly Chris Bowen and your government seem hell bent on not having any discussions about the possibility of employing nuclear energy. I think they have these small nuclear reactors, they do exist in some countries. Why is there this unwillingness to even have a discussion about perhaps heading down the trail of nuclear energy?
PRIME MINISTER: Well talk about a thought bubble. He has a website, but he's not prepared to say he supports it. He should say where the nuclear power plants are going to go, who's gonna pay for them, because no one will invest because it doesn't make sense economically. Look, every five years or so - this happened way back, you might remember, John Howard had Ziggy Switkowski do a report - they pop up every five years or so saying 'nukes are the answer'. No one will invest in it because it doesn't make economic sense, because it's the most expensive form of new energy. And in Australia, we have an abundance of access to renewables. What we need to do is to make sure that we bring the grid into the 21st century. There's not a state or territory government putting their hand up saying they support this. This is a complete distraction from what we need to do from a political party that had distractions for ten years but didn't have a policy and has left us vulnerable to the international market. It is just a thought bubble from Ted O'Brien. And if Ted O'Brien wants to put his hand up and say where the nuclear power plants will go and who will pay for it, who will fund it, then he'll be taken seriously. This is a complete distraction. And it would take as well, many, many years. What we have at the moment is a supply issue. We're dealing with that in the best way we can. But we're also dealing with the immediate price issue which households and businesses are facing right now. And Ted O'Brien is saying that he's not prepared to do anything to support households and businesses. Well, if he wants to stand for higher prices, he can argue that and he can vote that way on Thursday. But he will be held to account for it. And I noticed today that there are Liberal Party members like Russell Broadbent saying that there's no way that they're going to vote against a proposal that's about lower power prices. And I welcome the comments from some sensible people on Liberal backbench.
KING: Well, I think even Jacqui Lambie has said she'll have no other choice than to vote for the energy bill to ensure relief gets through to people that need it. But look, I'm just interested because there are a lot of these so-called energy market experts. And there seem to be heaps of them around at the moment that aren't necessarily tied to mining companies or energy providers saying that your government's plan is only going to drive prices up. Why is it that some people are saying exactly the opposite to what you're saying the impact of this plan will have?
PRIME MINISTER: Well have a look at people like Rod Sims, who's out there today, he used to run various agencies of the Commonwealth Government, appointed by the former Coalition government, he's out there welcoming our proposal. Jessica Irvine, in the Nine Newspapers today, is welcoming the proposal. The Energy Users Association is welcoming the proposal. The manufacturers out there saying thank goodness that the Federal Government is prepared to intervene. These are extraordinary times that require an extraordinary measure. We're doing it in a responsible way, in a temporary way and in a way that will make a difference. Throughout the world you are seeing governments respond. In the United Kingdom you have a super profits tax being put on as a result of the spike in prices and then a rebate paid to consumers. We're not going down the the new large tax route, deliberately. We have consulted widely. We think this is getting the balance exactly right.
KING: I really appreciate your time this morning, thank you very much for that. I hope you have a safe and a happy Christmas and are you tipping Australia to beat South Africa and the first test getting underway on Saturday?
PRIME MINISTER: I certainly hope so. But it'll be a tougher assignment I think then the West Indies, who are going through a rebuilding phase and was struck with injuries. The South African team is very, very strong. And I look forward to spending some time watching it on the telly at the Gabba, the first test. And I look forward to the Sydney test of course in the new year.
KING: All right, thank you for your time and again have a safe and a happy Christmas, Prime Minister.
PRIME MINISTER: Thanks very much Richard and to all of your listeners, I want to wish them and their families a very Merry Christmas and for those people of faith, a holy Christmas as well.